A video of Cesar Millan is going around the internet right now of him training a dog. Thought I’d give it a look and sure enough it was an episode I had previously watched back before I had crossed over. I was surprised at my reaction. With all the new knowledge on dog behavior and emotions, I was rather appalled while I watched him hold the dog up at the end of a slip lead – “hanging” the dog. Before, when I was a fan, I would have understood and agreed with his methods. I would have seen this as the dog was being dominant and needed to submit to the exercise, that the dog needed to become calm submissive in this situation – around other dogs. I was well versed in his descriptive dog behavior language. However, my reaction today was completely the opposite! I wanted to yell though the computer at him to tell him to stop choking the dog! This reaction actually surprised me, this was the first time I had really watched one of his episodes since my crossing over. It truly pained me to watch this poor husky be strangled and tortured – the dog showed so much discomfort and panic as he chewed at the leash to try to set himself free. He jumped up not to be “dominant to Cesar, but to try to alleviate the pressure around his neck – as any normal living-being would! It hit me hard because I saw my own dog in that position. Loker, who is a husky mix, would have most likely done the same thing. I probably had done this to him myself at some point (although not to this intensity). I am so glad I am through with that kind of “training.” In fact, it really isn’t even training. You aren’t teaching the dog to do ANYTHING, you are choking it out so that it gives up and becomes a zombie… The dog in this video, Shadow, did not want to be near the other dog. He wanted to get away and was already in “fight or flight” mode, but since he could not get away, he was forced to fight. When a dog is in that mode, or anyone for that matter, they know their safety is in danger and you cannot expect ANYONE (dog or human) to learn anything while in this state of mind.
But how do I know he wants to get away? Well, there is a series of body language signals I saw. If you watch at 0:34, Shadow actually backs up and tries to get behind Cesar, he is trying to avoid confrontation with the other dog. If you watch at minute 2:50, he is avoiding eye contact despite being super close to the other dog. In general, Shadow never really ever charges at the other dog, Cesar never lets him get to that point because as soon as Shadow shows interest or alertness, he is “corrected” or choked. Shadow’s face expresses concern – in my eyes. Every time Cesar chokes him out, he tries to chew the leash to escape. When Cesar puts him on the ground, Shadow is still tense – licking his lips (calming signal) as well as a bent front leg which shows tension at about 4:15 of the video. His eyes are squinting at this time which is not a sign of relaxation – in this case it is stiffness and tension.
Cesar approaches dogs as if they are still highly primal animals, but really they are incredibly intelligent and are capable of creating new emotional reactions to stimuli with our (humans) help and proper training – through building new associations in their mind of the stimuli. I wish people would realize this – I am sure glad I did!
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April 21, 2012 at 11:54 pm
BEX
I remember watching that video the first time. My heart rate was incredibly high and I let out a few sobs. How is this entertainment? He set that dog up to fail, then gave it no escape option, then provoked a response, then violently forced the dog into terrified submission.
April 22, 2012 at 2:49 pm
Jamie CPDT-KA
I too use to be Compulsion/aversive/archaic/balanced (pick a word they use now to describe using force, threats and pain to train). I tell People I use to work on the dark side of the force, but moved onward and upward to the light side, I used those methods back in the 70’s but I am not stuck in the 70’s I found new research and changed with the times. I see Cesar show and now describe to others what is going on in real life, and it doesn’t quite match what he is saying. Someone told me in some of his newer shows he has used +R methods, I have not seen them, so can’t say yay or nay. Thank you for standing up and be recognized for changing to better help the “best friends” we take into our lives. Jamie CPDT-KA
April 23, 2012 at 6:26 pm
thecrossovertrainer
Thanks for reading! Be sure to sign up to follow my blog if you haven’t already! š Also, thank you for your encouraging words!
April 23, 2012 at 2:53 pm
Kimberly Burgan, CPDT-KA
Great write up, gal!
April 23, 2012 at 6:27 pm
thecrossovertrainer
Thanks for reading! Be sure to sign up to follow my blog if you haven’t already! š Thanks for your support!
April 23, 2012 at 3:47 pm
Kim -CPDT-KA
This really is a particularly distrubing bit of video. Equally disturbing to hear the owner voice-over, saying “it’s just dominance and it can be easily harnessed and redirected.” Even if you bought the whole dominance whooey, I’m wondering what part of that looked easy to them. I would venture a guess that the dog didn’t see it that way.
I’m a cross-over trainer as well, but even at my most punitive stage, I never “picked fights” with dogs in the way that he does. I believe that even “back in the day”, my heart would have hurt for this dog…set up to fail and without enough information to have even a clue as to what to do to survive the ordeal. How do people watch this without realizing that he’s choked that dog out? That blue tongue should be noticable to anyone. Who could watch a human being’s tongue turn blue and not realize that it’s a sign of asphyxiation? I honestly wonder how he gets away with doing these things on national TV.
“Calm submissive”
I would like to see the actual definition for this “term.” Obviously, partial loss of conciousness would be there somewhere. I look forward to the day when no one uses that term anymore.
You’ve done a very nice job of breaking this scenario down to give people a realistic picture of what is happening here. I can only hope that many will see your blog post. If it can change even one person’s mind about this type of abusive “rehabilitation” then you’ve done a great service here.
April 23, 2012 at 6:28 pm
thecrossovertrainer
Thanks for reading! Be sure to sign up to follow my blog if you haven’t already! š And yes, this video really did it for me the other day. My reaction has completely changed since I first saw it months ago while watching his show. I am so happy to have crossed over! Be sure to “share” this page with your friends to help spread the word!
April 23, 2012 at 5:59 pm
Michael
I really appreciate this contrast in POV. I am a relatively recent cross-over but I’ve put it behind me and it’s been long enough that I do have the same clarity of memory that you have. Around 2008/9, this video was one of the first videos that help me solidify my complete cross over. I had been on the fence for a while previous and was at the point of 99% crossover until I saw the erroneous logic shown in this video. Keep up the good work, I love being able to follow your growth as a trainer.
April 23, 2012 at 6:29 pm
thecrossovertrainer
Thanks for reading! Be sure to sign up to follow my blog if you haven’t already! š It makes me so happy to see that I am not the only one who has recently crossed over! Thanks for the kind words!!
May 1, 2012 at 8:48 am
Ginger
Hello Ines, I hope you are well. I do remember watching this episode more than once and I disagree with the interpretation. It was hard to watch but for different reasons. Unpleasant things can and often need to happen on our way to a positive result. Given the size of the human and the dog it was definitely challenging for Cesar. Often dogs that are acting out of control have an unpleasant transition as they are rehabilitated. It’s not pretty. It doesn’t mean you’re/they’re not being positive, but the target is rebelling. I believe you can be pack oriented and positive at the same time. You know me and my dog, I’m not a professional trainer, just offering my perspective. But I do know the calm energy is key whether it’s called positive, crossover or pack perspective training. This applies to all of us whether or not a canine is involved. It’s interesting how we all interpret things differently and most of it comes from past experiences, daily life experiences we’re running through our own filters . The opposition here reminds of parents that I see reasoning with a 4 year old child as an adult instead of taking charge and providing leadership. Positive just like likes and dislikes are subjective. Again, just offering my perspective. All that said I wish you nothing but the best of success in your transition, training business and biology studies at UT.
May 1, 2012 at 9:01 am
thecrossovertrainer
Thank you Ginger! Thanks for checking out my blog! We should meet up sometime so that I can talk to you about my transition. I used to be a fan of Cesar Millan just like you – you know that! š With some new education, positive training techniques are eye opening – like an “ah ha!” moment. So we should meet up so that I can explain a little bit about it. You may find out that you end up agreeing! š
May 1, 2012 at 9:27 am
Ginger
Hello Ines, I would be delighted to meet up sometime if it works out. I also appreciate your openness even if at the end of the day we agree to disagree. It’s interesting, dog training/behavior methods is almost as hot a topic as politics or religion š and Cesar has been a target for many years. In fact the episode of the video clip is from many years ago. As he says in one of his books, put 10 trainers in a room and they’ll have many different methods and will be passionate about them and think the others are wrong. He doesn’t try to make others wrong, just offers his approach. What has always intrigued me and is why I got interested in the show is the the beliefs and practices underneath everything. Being calm and in balance as a human, regardless if one has a dog or not. Approaching things with gratitude and positive affirmations has created such a turnaround for me. I was at this point of discovery when I saw the show and read his books. The canine aspect was a residual effect of it for me. Having Zivah has advanced these learnings and I truly can see her as a barometer of me and my energy. I constantly attempt to remain grateful and appreciative and am enjoying the awareness and growth from it.
May 1, 2012 at 9:33 am
thecrossovertrainer
Great! I will message you on Facebook so that we can figure out a time to meet up š I will not try to convince you, I will try to simply educate you about this new method I am taking on. I agree, what attracted me to Cesar was his over attitude – at the beginning. However, even before I crossed over, I was beginning to worry because of his increased use of shock collars..
So that along with my new dog and new education all played a role in helping me to take a more positive approach. Talk to you on Facebook soon!
May 1, 2012 at 9:39 am
thecrossovertrainer
I would also like to point you to an article that discusses calming signals and stress signals in dogs. It is a great read if you have a minute. š This is one thing Cesar doesn’t know much about and it gave me a whole new perspective on dog body language. http://www.canis.no/rugaas/onearticle.php?artid=1
May 19, 2012 at 6:19 am
pawsforpraise
I really hope that you give more consideration to obtaining the kind of education that Ines and others have sought. Science tells us that all four quadrants of operant conditioning work. Ethics tells us that if that’s true, we need to use the quadrants that don’t induce pain or fear. It’s a choice that brings so much relief to our dogs as they learn.
May 2, 2012 at 12:20 pm
crystalpegasus1
I too, like so many others, am a crossover trainer. My oldest German Shepherd is a rescue, and he came out of a stud, puppy-mill situation with a nasty case of dog aggression. After trying all the traditional, punitive methods (and admittedly following and watching everything Cesar Millan put out), we had a really broken and even more, highly aggressive dog. We found a positive trainer nearby and within a week, our dog had changed his tune. That was about two years ago now, and I haven’t looked back since. Our new German Shepherd is 8 months old, has been clicker trained since 8 weeks and begins herding training in about two weeks. She and Smokey are best friends and cuddle regularly (so much for that dog aggression!)
As far as I can tell, Shelby will be breaking considerable ground in the herding realm, considering many (most, really) herding trainers still rely almost solely on punitive methods. We will be working positively, and I’m hoping to see great results and maybe change some minds myself! I remember seeing a video after I’d crossed over of Cesar Millan “flooding” a dog, by pulling it onto a linoleum surface where the dog had experienced a trauma and correcting it the entire way. After I’d crossed over, I sat in front of the TV and cried. I looked at our boy Smokey and just had to go to the kitchen, get half a bag of treats and feed them to him one by one. Really enjoyed reading your blog – I know EXACTLY what you mean!
May 2, 2012 at 2:23 pm
thecrossovertrainer
Always happy to hear I’m not the only one! Thank you for your support! š
May 14, 2012 at 12:53 pm
Sian
I’m wondering if your FB frined knows what the term “crossover” means. It did seem to me, reading her post, that she thinks it’s a “method”.
You may wish to point out to her that it describes a trainer who made the “cross over” from punishing, aversive methods, to kind, understanding methods.
So a “crossover” trainer is a trainer who has “crossed over” from the dark side, the uneducated side.